Craig Constantine: Parkour evangelist

My good friend Mark Hochgesang recently invited me to be on his Heavy Hitter Sports. I have heavy imposter syndrome when it comes to talking about movement. None the less, here’s the episode…


Craig Constantine, the host of the Movers Mindset podcast, shares the wonders of parkour with host Mark Hochgesang. Craig highlights the physical & mental challenges & rewards of this one-of-a-kind sport birthed from the Paris suburbs. Parkour newcomers & veterans alike will be entertained & enlightened by Craig’s engaging storytelling.

Craig’s Website:
Craig’s LinkedIn:
Craig’s Facebook:
Movers Mindset Podcast:
Open+Curious Podcast:
Podtalk Podcast:

Julie Angel’s Movement of Three Film:

Listeners, please subscribe to Heavy Hitter Sports wherever you listen to podcasts so that you don’t miss any future episodes. Ideally, please also rate and review the show. And share this episode with a coworker, friend or family member who it might benefit.

Feel free to reach out if you have suggestions re future episode guests or topics. Mark’s contact info is noted below. Many thanks.

MiST with Iron Gump

Iron Gump joins Craig Constantine to share how meditative strength training bridges the gap between physical exertion and mindful awareness.

This is what you were talking about earlier. The meditative aspect. What I call it is meditative strength training (MiST). The meditative aspect is developing the awareness as you move, and then maintaining that awareness as you move. So taking very simple exercises— […] So that people feel, ‘Okay, I’m not going into this super extreme odd space where I don’t know what to do.’

~ Iron Gump (13:17)

Craig and Iron Gump explore the integration of mindfulness with physical training, discussing how meditative practices can enhance strength exercises. Iron Gump shares his progression from traditional Chinese martial arts in his teenage years to weight training and eventually to a blend of both disciplines. He emphasizes the significance of combining body alignment and breath work with exercises like squats and lunges, transforming them into meditative practices. This approach, which he calls “meditative strength training,” helps individuals develop a deeper awareness of their movements and maintain mindfulness throughout their workouts.

They also discuss the benefits of barefoot training, with Iron Gump recounting his experiences running and hiking barefoot in various terrains. He explains how this practice improves sensitivity and proprioception, leading to better reaction times and overall body awareness.

Additionally, Iron Gump shares his teaching experiences with diverse groups, from elderly women in Maui to fighters in a South Philly gym. He highlights how slowing down movements and focusing on alignment can reveal hidden weaknesses and enhance overall strength and conditioning, drawing on principles from Tai Chi and other martial arts.


Exploring meditative strength training — emphasizes the combination of body alignment and breath work with exercises like squats and lunges to develop mindfulness.

Importance of mindfulness in physical training — highlights how being aware of movements and maintaining that awareness enhances workout effectiveness.

The role of traditional Chinese martial arts — discusses the influence of martial arts in developing physical and meditative aspects of training.

Benefits of barefoot training — describes how running and hiking barefoot improve sensitivity, proprioception, and reaction times.

Challenges and rewards of teaching diverse groups — shares experiences working with elderly women and fighters, adapting training methods to suit different populations.

Transforming everyday exercises — illustrates how simple exercises can become meditative by incorporating alignment and breath work.

Connection between slow movements and strength — explains how slowing down movements and focusing on alignment can reveal weaknesses and improve strength.

Integration of martial arts principles in fitness — talks about applying Tai Chi and other martial arts concepts to modern strength and conditioning routines.

Developing body awareness — emphasizes the importance of understanding body mechanics and alignment in enhancing physical training.

Adapting traditional practices for modern fitness — discusses how traditional exercises can be made relevant and beneficial for contemporary fitness enthusiasts.

Resources — Iron Gump’s web site with additional links and contact methods.

@1IronGump — Iron Gump Instagram showcases various exercises and training methods, providing insights into meditative strength training practices.

Master Keith Maza — Iron Gump’s current teacher, specializing in internal arts.

Royal Striking — Muay Thai gym in South Philly

(Written with help from Chat-GPT.)

Freerunning with George McGowan

George McGowan discusses his journey through Parkour and his philosophical approach to movement, sharing insights on achieving perfection through relentless practice and creativity.

I think that carried over into my style, and then as I progressed it just got more… I was more critical of myself. But it’s my style of training, and I want the line to be—in my eyes—perfect and if I’m happy with it, then that’s all that matters. And having the clip at the end is just a bonus to me.

~ George McGowan, (04:30)

Craig Constantine welcomes George McGowan, a Freerunning and Parkour enthusiast and filmmaker, to discuss his experiences and insights into the world of movement. Early in the conversation, they discuss a recent documentary featuring George, emphasizing the dedication and meticulous approach required to master Parkour moves. George elaborates on his collaboration with notable figures like Robbie Corbett and his participation in events like the USA Parkour Cup, highlighting how these experiences have fostered valuable relationships and opportunities in the Parkour community.

George shares his philosophy on training and Parkour lines, explaining that achieving perfection in his movements is paramount, a sentiment reflected in his rigorous practice routine as seen in the documentary. He talks about his preference for efficient and fluid movements over showy, disconnected tricks, underscoring his focus on the aesthetics and functionality of each sequence.

Additionally, George discusses the influence of his peers, particularly from his early days training in Belfast, on developing a perfectionist approach to Parkour. This mindset extends into how he visualizes and plans his movements, often laying in bed thinking about the next day’s potential lines and challenges.


Exploration of Parkour documentaries — the conversation opens with a discussion about a documentary that delves into the intricacies of Parkour, focusing on the commitment and precision required to excel in the sport.

Importance of collaboration and networking — highlights how relationships built through Parkour, such as with notable athletes and event participation, play a crucial role in expanding opportunities and experiences within the community.

Philosophy and approach to training — emphasizes a meticulous and perfection-oriented approach to Parkour, where each movement and line is critically analyzed and practiced extensively to achieve the desired perfection.

Influence of community and mentors — discusses the significant impact that local Parkour legends and peers have on a person’s training ethos, particularly how early influences can shape one’s technical skills and overall approach to the sport.

Visualization and mental preparation — sheds light on the mental aspect of Parkour, where visualizing movements and lines the night before training helps enhance performance and creativity.

Adaptation and evolution of practice — explores how one’s style and focus in Parkour may evolve, from performing high-impact moves to prioritizing efficiency and flow in movements as one matures in the sport.

Global Parkour community — touches on the desire to connect with Parkour practitioners worldwide, particularly from regions known for producing exceptionally skilled athletes, to learn and draw inspiration.

The joy and personal satisfaction of Parkour — conveys that beyond technical achievement, the personal joy and satisfaction derived from mastering challenging movements are the core motivations for engaging in Parkour.

Future aspirations and openness to new challenges — reflects on future goals, including the integration of other forms of movement and fitness into Parkour practice to maintain health, enjoyment, and overall well-being.


Meet the BOUNCIEST Freerunner on Earth — Recent documentary and training video with George McGowan, by JimmyTheGiant.

Robbie Corbett — Mentioned as a collaborator in the Parkour documentary, known for his involvement in the Parkour community.

USA Parkour Cup — An event where Parkour athletes compete, and where George McGowan had notable participation in 2022.

World Freerunning Parkour Federation (WFPF) — An organization involved in the promotion and structuring of Parkour and Freerunning worldwide. Mentioned as having invited George to participate in a documentary.

@georgepkay — George McGowan on Instagram

ADAPT Qualifications — A certification program for Parkour coaching, mentioned as a credential held by George McGowan.

Motus Project — YouTube search results for George and Motus Project videos.

International Parkour Federation — Contains some information and links on Iran’s parkour community and athletes, who George expressed a desire to train with and learn from.

(Written with help from Chat-GPT.)

Perspective with Jamie Holmes

Jamie Holmes joins Craig to discuss life’s admin tasks, her journey through holistic healing from melanoma, and insights into the world of circus arts and personal fitness showcasing her multifaceted life and philosophies.

I think it was three months from when I had my first, initial consult with my surgeon, and he said, “okay I can get you in. It’s going to be a bit harder because you’re doing both hips at once, but I can get you in within three months.” And that was horrid to me! I was like, “I have to live three more months like this!?” It wasn’t just that it hurt a little bit when I walked— I couldn’t move— I could not move— I was having weird panic attacks all the time, because if I dropped something and had to bend over, it was— I’m a bit of a tough cookie, but that? That broke me pretty hard.”

~ Jamie Holmes, 35:15

Not your average bears, Craig and Jamie begin in left field discussing ways of managing life’s “admin” tasks. Jamie professes integrating everything into her daily flow, rather than reserving them for a single day. Her approach, she explains, allows her to work at a high speed, avoiding the buildup of dreaded tasks. Her method emphasizes efficiency and the mental ease that comes from staying ahead of administrative duties, reflecting a deeper understanding of personal productivity and time management.

The conversation shifts into Jamie’s profound journey through holistic healing after a melanoma diagnosis. Rejecting traditional treatment paths, Jamie opts for a holistic approach, guided by her conviction in the body’s healing capabilities and her passion for health and fitness. This segment of the discussion not only highlights her resilience but also serves as an inspiring testament to the power of our minds and bodies.

Jamie also shares insights into the world of circus arts and her studio, The Circus Fix, illuminating the challenges and rewards of managing a fitness and arts studio. Her narrative encompasses the delicate balance of artistic passion with the pragmatism of business management, underscoring the significance of adaptability and understanding in leadership roles.


Efficiency in daily tasks—integrating administrative duties into everyday life can enhance productivity and reduce stress.

Holistic healing approaches—exploring non-traditional methods for dealing with serious health issues, such as melanoma, can lead to personal insights and unexpected journeys.

The importance of movement—engaging in physical activities, whether through circus arts or other forms of exercise, is vital for mental and physical health.

Adapting to individual needs—understanding and accommodating the unique ways people process and work can lead to better management and teamwork.

The value of outdoor activities—spending time in nature, particularly in activities like walking on the beach, can serve as a form of meditation and rejuvenation.

Facing life-changing decisions—confronting severe health challenges with courage and openness to unconventional treatments can inspire others.

The challenge of balancing—managing a small business, especially in the arts, requires juggling creative passion with the practicalities of administration and leadership.

The role of community—creating spaces for learning and growth, such as a circus studio, contributes to the well-being and development of both instructors and students.

Personal transformation through adversity—overcoming physical and mental hurdles can lead to profound personal growth and a deeper understanding of one’s capacities and resilience.


The Circus Fix — Jamie Holmes’ circus studio, offering classes in aerial arts and other circus disciplines. — Jamie’s web site with all her professional details.

Carrots, Coffee, and Cancer — Jamie’s book recounting her approach to overcoming melanoma, emphasizing diet, lifestyle, and alternative treatments.

Instagram@jamie7holmes and @thecircusfixto

Surrounded by Idiots — by Thomas Erikson as briefly mentioned in this episode as a resource in relation to understanding team dynamics.

(Written with help from Chat-GPT.)

Perspective – with Giles D’Souza

Giles D’Souza shares his journey from navigating the bustling streets of Mumbai to finding tranquility in movement, as he and Craig Constantine unravel the essence of living fully in the moment amidst the chaos of modern life.

You can take this time for yourself. You can take this time for your clients— take this time for this— and anything above that is it’s fine. Just let it go.

~ Giles D’Souza, 3:15

Giles D’Souza and Craig Constantine navigate the relationships between work, personal growth, and the concept of living fully in the moment. Giles shares his transformative experience of returning from a long journey overseas, which provided him with a fresh perspective on balancing work and personal life. He emphasizes the direct correlation between work and income, especially as a self-employed individual, and how stepping away allowed him to reassess and prioritize his time and activities upon returning. This segment of the discussion highlights the importance of finding equilibrium between professional commitments and personal well-being, suggesting that a deliberate pause can lead to a more fulfilling and intentional way of living.

The conversation also gets into the philosophical, exploring concepts of consciousness, the significance of the present moment, and the universal human experience of navigating life’s fleeting nature. Giles reflects on the practice of mindfulness and the art of letting go, sharing personal anecdotes that underscore the power of focusing on the present to alleviate the burdens of past grievances and future anxieties. This part of the conversation considers the impact of external environments on well-being, with Giles discussing the challenges of living in Mumbai, a city with significant pollution, and how it has influenced his desire for a life closer to nature. Through these discussions, the conversation weaves together themes of personal development, environmental awareness, and the pursuit of simplicity and clarity in a complex world.


The importance of balance — discussing the challenge of managing work and personal life, especially when self-employed, and the value of taking breaks to reassess one’s priorities.

The power of mindfulness — exploring how being present and letting go of past and future worries can significantly improve mental well-being and perspective on life.

Environmental impact on lifestyle — sharing personal experiences of how living in a polluted city can influence one’s health and happiness, and the longing for a life closer to nature.

The significance of the present moment — emphasizing that every second is precious and should be lived fully, whether it’s through work, leisure, or simply being.

The transformative effect of travel — reflecting on how travel can expand one’s perspective, not by ticking off checklist items but by deeply experiencing and immersing oneself in different cultures and environments.

The philosophical exploration of consciousness — delving into the nature of consciousness, the miracle of waking life, and the profound impact of considering our place in the universe.

The aspiration for a sustainable and peaceful living environment — dreaming of a life in the mountains, self-sufficient and in harmony with nature, highlighting the desire for simplicity and tranquility away from urban chaos.

Resources — Giles D’Souza on Instagram

DarkSky International — The conversation touches upon the importance of the night sky

(Written with help from Chat-GPT.)

Awareness – with Anna Bezuglova

Anna Bezuglova transforms the mundane into sacred practice, challenging our perceptions of daily life and movement with insights from her unique journey and teaching philosophy.

“The dialogue of sacredness of deep meaning is something that is often connected to daily things. It’s not only the physical practice that I treat in such a way but also just daily moments and living life. Being present to it all the time— and it doesn’t matter whether I’m doing an official session of practice, or I’m driving a car, or I’m talking to my husband, or I’m teaching a class, or I’m just walking down the road. I think this mindset shifts something in the way you do things day to day.”

~ Anna Bezuglova, 3:00

In a deeply reflective conversation, Anna describes how she treats daily practices as sacred, a wisdom imparted by her Zen teacher. She shares her journey of recognizing the sacredness in her routines, initially performing practices that outwardly seemed sacred to others but later realizing their intrinsic value to herself. Anna emphasizes the importance of being present in every moment, whether it’s in a structured practice session or the simple acts of daily living, highlighting how this mindset transforms the mundane into something deeply meaningful.

Anna’s reflections extend into the lessons learned from her father, a martial arts teacher and a Buddhist, who, despite never directly teaching her martial arts, deeply influenced her perspective on life and practice. She recounts growing up in the challenging times of the 1990s in Russia, drawing resilience and a unique outlook from her parents’ examples. This background informs her teaching philosophy, where she advocates for a holistic approach to movement that intertwines physical, cognitive, and emotional aspects.

Anna argues for the significance of continuous change, consistency, and awareness in practice, underlining how these elements contribute to a fulfilling and transformative journey. Through her narrative, she challenges listeners to see movement not just as physical exercise, but as a comprehensive method to engage with life, fostering change, and personal growth.


The sacredness of daily practice — a reflection on how integrating conscious intention into routine activities transforms them into meaningful practices.

The influence of upbringing — discussing how parental examples, especially in the face of adversity, shape resilience and perspectives on life and practice.

The concept of change in practice — emphasizing that constant evolution and adaptation in one’s practice mirrors the dynamic nature of life itself.

The importance of awareness — highlighting how paying attention to the body’s movement and presence in space can significantly improve one’s practice and overall well-being.

The role of a teacher — the necessity of embodying the principles one teaches, as coherence between words and actions fosters trust and facilitates learning.

The power of coordination — explaining how developing coordination through movement practices can enhance the ability to adapt and succeed in various aspects of life.

The commitment to long-term learning — advocating for the importance of dedication and persistence in practice to experience genuine transformation.


Having a Practice — Anna’s blog post mentioned by Craig.

The Bamboo Body — Anna Bezuglova’s movement school in Barcelona based on Ido Portal teachings.

@anna.bamboo — on Instagram

The Bamboo Body — on YouTube

Feldenkrais Method — A movement pedagogy designed to improve body awareness and enhance movement efficiency through gentle exercises and mindful practice. The method was developed by Moshé Feldenkrais and is used worldwide to assist in rehabilitation and promote physical and mental well-being.

Ido Portal Method — A holistic approach to movement culture pioneered by Ido Portal, focusing on developing strength, mobility, and the physical and mental aspects of movement practice. It encourages exploration of various disciplines, from martial arts to dance.

(Written with help from Chat-GPT.)

Breath – with Julie Angel

Julie Angel describes her multifaceted approach to movement, breath–work, and life as ‘everything everywhere all at once,’ revealing a seamless blend of creativity, transformation, and minimalism in her practices.

I’m really lazy. I’m a high performance slacker. And so it has to be simple and minimalist in doing it. If there’s any practice where it’s like: You need to buy all of this equipment, and you need to do all of these things, and you need a membership… I’m just like, no no that’ll be a no. All of those things cause friction points for me, and I don’t do them. So I mean there’s a minimalism, a simplicity, a creativity, and an adaptability; which is why to other people it may seem very different that I I wear all these these hats which I’m equally multi-passionate about. But for me I’m like, same same. [ed: It’s all the same.]

~ Julie Angel, 2:50

Julie Angel and Craig dive into the worlds of movement, breath-work, and the emotional landscape of physical practice. Julie shares her holistic view on movement, emphasizing that everything she does—whether it’s filmmaking, practicing parkour, training others, or walking her dog—interconnects through common threads of exploration, transformation, curiosity, and creativity. The absence of division between her various interests, highlights the blending of her professional and personal pursuits that are driven by a consistent creative spark and a quest for simplicity and minimalism in practice.

Julie also introduces the transformative power of breath–work, recounting her journey from being intrigued by MovNat Aquatics courses to exploring the physiological and psychological impacts of breathing techniques. She discusses her discovery of dysfunctional breathing patterns and how addressing these can profoundly affect one’s health, well–being, and movement capabilities.

Julie’s exploration into breath–work is not just a personal quest but also an educational endeavor, as she aims to share this knowledge through her work, showcasing the significant, often under-appreciated role that breathing plays in enhancing movement, reducing anxiety, and improving overall life quality.


Exploring the interconnectedness of activities — how different aspects of life, from professional endeavors to personal hobbies, can intertwine and inform each other, creating a seamless blend of experiences.

The significance of creativity in movement — discussing how a creative element is vital for engagement and passion in practices like parkour and breath–work, emphasizing the role of creativity in sustaining interest and exploration.

Breath-work as a transformative tool — highlighting the journey into breath-work and its profound impact on mental and physical health, from enhancing movement capabilities to reducing anxiety and improving overall well-being.

The emotional aspect of movement — exploring movement not just as a physical activity but as an emotionally charged experience that can influence thoughts, actions, and overall life quality.

Simplicity and minimalism in practice — the importance of adopting a minimalist approach to practices, avoiding over-complication to maintain focus, enjoyment, and consistency in various activities.

The role of breath-work in functional movement — detailing how efficient breathing patterns can significantly enhance movement quality, recovery, and performance, underpinning the foundational role of breath-work in physical practices.

Addressing dysfunctional breathing patterns — uncovering the widespread issue of dysfunctional breathing and its implications, with strategies and insights into how correcting these patterns can lead to significant health and performance benefits.

The impact of mindset and perception on physical health — discussing research on the mind-body connection, emphasizing how one’s mindset and perceptions can tangibly affect physical health and aging.

Resources — Julie Angel’s website offers insights into her work with movement and breath–work, including courses and resources for those interested in exploring these areas further.

Julie Angel — Julie on LinkedIn.

The Mindful Body by Dr. Ellen Langer — A book discussing the power of the mind over the body, including the famous Counterclockwise study, which explores concepts of mindfulness and placebo effects on health and aging.

Environment, ‘natural movement,’ and breathing — Movers Mindset podcast episode with MaryBeth Gangemi. — Julie Thom, trauma informed movement & life coaching.

Built to Move by Kelly Starrett and Juliet Starrett — This book emphasizes the importance of movement and breathwork as foundational elements for health, detailing practical strategies for improving physical and mental well-being. — Oxygen Advantage program focused on improving health and performance through specialized breathing techniques that aim to optimize oxygen and carbon dioxide levels in the body. — Vic Verdier, a MovNat Aquatics instructor known for his deep cave and wreck diving records, Verdier’s teachings on breath–work highlight the importance of understanding respiratory chemistry for enhanced movement and health.

How to Keep Your Edge as You Get Older — Podcast episode with Vic Verdier, mentioned by Craig in this conversation. — MovNat is a physical education and fitness system based on natural human movement skills, aiming to improve strength, mobility, and the ability to perform practical tasks. — Wim Hof Method is a combination of cold therapy, breathing techniques, and commitment that has been claimed to contribute to physical and mental wellness.

(Written with help from Chat-GPT.)

Rasa – with Andrew Suseno

Andrew Suseno joins Craig to describe how Moving Rasa transforms trauma into collective healing and empowerment through movement, redefining personal boundaries and identity in profound ways.

Andrew Suseno describes the transformative work of Moving Rasa, a continuation from his earlier focus on Parcon Resilience. Andrew and Craig begin with an introduction to two upcoming retreats designed for Asian American Pacific Islanders and BIPOC communities, emphasizing rest, recuperation, and abolition. These retreats aim to support community organizers by reconnecting them with their bodies and helping restore their life rhythms. The events serve as a platform for individuals from marginalized communities to engage in healing practices, fostering a sense of empowerment and collective well-being.

Rasa means taste in Indonesian, and it also means discernment of feeling with the heart. It isn’t just about what our relationship to food is, but it’s what our relationship to anything is— whether it’s a picture on the wall, a book that we read, a friend, a value that we might have. And just like we might have a sensory understanding of what something tastes like, we have a sensory understanding of our rasa for anything. And that sensory understanding can be moved into and explored and improvised with and moved with others.

~ Andrew Suseno, 5:25

Andrew elucidates the concept of “Rasa,” explaining its multifaceted meanings that encompass taste, discernment of feeling with the heart, and essence in various languages, including Indonesian and Sanskrit. This concept underpins the ethos of Moving Rasa, encouraging participants to explore and connect with their essence through movement improvisation.

The conversation further explores the transformative potential of acknowledging and moving through trauma in community settings. Through the lens of Moving Rasa, Andrew shares insights into creating spaces where individuals can engage in self-discovery and collective healing. The dialogue highlights the importance of patience, love, and community in navigating personal and collective liberation journeys, offering a nuanced perspective on time, self-love, and the construction of communal identities.

What if we started with ourselves? What if we forgave ourselves for punishing ourselves? What does that open up in our relationships with others, with ourselves, with objects, with ideas? What movements are possible there? …both literally—physically—movements, but also what movements are possible in the world? …what you can create?

~ Andrew Suseno, 31:01


The concept of Rasa — a multifaceted term signifying taste, discernment of feeling, and essence, guiding participants towards connecting with their cultural and personal essence.

Community healing and empowerment — Moving Rasa retreats aimed at Asian American Pacific Islanders and BIPOC, focusing on creating spaces for individuals to restore rhythms and engage with their bodies in a healing manner.

Creating brave spaces — as a method to support trauma recovery and collective healing.

The importance of collective identity — a way of sharing burdens and expanding the definition of identities within community spaces, fostering self-determination and expansive identity construction.

Abolition as a personal and collective journey — introduced as a theme for contemplation and practice, encouraging self-forgiveness and the cessation of self-punishment to unlock new possibilities in relationships and movements.

The role of patience, love, and community — as foundational elements in the practice, with a call to reevaluate our relationship with time, cultivate self-love through community support, and actively engage in co-creating a shared future.


The specific, upcoming events mentioned in this episode are: Feb 16 — AAPI Emergent Retreat and Feb 23 — BIPOC Emergent Retreat

Moving Rasa Testimonials — Testimonials page, for the several testimonials discussed. — Moving Rasa is an improvisational movement form and contemplative practice that may be practiced anywhere. Movers connect their inner world to their outer movement AND how it is organized in relation to others, objects, and the environment. In particular, movers are supported to connect to their Rasa. — Upcoming Moving Rasa events.

@moving.rasa — on Instagram

Andrew Suseno: Ancestors, Parcon Resilience, and Rasicism — Andrew’s previous appearance on the Movers Mindset podcast.

Gotong-royong — An Indonesian philosophy mentioned as influencing the Moving Rasa process, emphasizing collective burden-sharing and expansive, self-determined identity construction.

(Written with help from Chat-GPT.)

Perspectives – with Jeremy Fein

Jeremy Fein, a coach who embraces the power of conversation, joins Craig to talk about the complexities of podcasting and coaching, revealing his journey from creating a successful podcast to purposefully pausing it to refocus.

[Coaching sessions are] much better when they’re not recorded, right? They’re better for the client, which is what matters. And so podcasting felt like a way that I could maybe bridge a gap between the actual work that I do, and— let’s call it content creation. You go to write a caption on Instagram, and it’s just so divorced from the work that I’m doing on a regular basis with clients. That’s why I started [the podcast].

~ Jeremy Fein, 4:28

Jeremy Fein discusses his experiences with podcasting and coaching. He reflects on why he started his podcast, “Nothing Makes Perfect,” acknowledging the abundance of podcasts and his desire to create something meaningful rather than just adding to the noise. Jeremy also delves into his decision to pause his podcast after 25 episodes, a choice driven by a need to reassess and focus on aspects of the podcast he enjoyed and could amplify.

He also talks about the intrinsic connection between his identity and coaching, emphasizing how coaching has become an integral part of who he is. Jeremy’s approach to coaching is deeply rooted in conversation, listening, and idea exploration, rather than traditional fitness instruction. This approach underscores his commitment to personalization in coaching, catering to individual client needs while maintaining a structured yet flexible coaching framework.


Starting a podcast with awareness — discusses the over-saturation of podcasts and the importance of adding value rather than just contributing to the noise.

Pausing a successful podcast — reflects on the decision to take a break, focusing on reassessment and personal growth.

Personal identity and coaching — highlights how coaching has become a part of the speaker’s identity, shaping both professional and personal life.

Adapting to clients’ needs in coaching — emphasizes the importance of personalization in coaching, catering to individual client needs.

Content creation in the digital age — explores the challenges of creating authentic content that resonates with the audience and the creator’s values.


@jeremyfein Jeremy Fein on Instagram. Message him there for conversations or inquiries about his coaching or podcasting experiences.

Fein Movement Jeremy’s web site with coaching information and additional ways to reach him.

Nothing Makes Perfect Jeremy’s podcast.

(Written with help from Chat-GPT.)

Collaboration – with John Baker

John Baker discusses his approach to blending traditional and digital media in art, emphasizing exploration and his love for movement, while exploring the possibility of combining these passions into a sustainable career.

[3 words to describe your practice?] The first one that comes to mind, which is pretty cliche, is: playful. It’s important to be playful and exploring, and not be so serious. Next one is softness. I guess it comes out of being injured in the past— but trying to be softer with movements and softer, gets more gentle in general. Then the third is— I haven’t decided— but collaborative or curious. Usually, with movements, or movement spheres, I like to inquire what other people are exploring.

~ John Baker 30:10

John Baker digs into the intersection of art and movement, exploring how his passion for both disciplines enriches his creative expression. He speaks about his journey in blending traditional and digital media, emphasizing the unique qualities and opportunities each medium offers. John’s approach to art is deeply rooted in exploration and creativity, reflecting his belief in storytelling through both visual and physical mediums. He shares insights on how he navigates the challenges of societal expectations and self-imposed limits while contemplating the integration of his artistic and movement practices into a sustainable career.

John also touches upon his training habits and the significant influence of music on his movement. He describes how different musical genres and rhythms inspire and shape his physical expressions, revealing a deep connection between auditory stimuli and bodily movement. This interplay highlights his holistic approach to creativity, where various elements of life seamlessly blend to inform and inspire his art and movement.


Exploration and creativity — The importance of these elements in both art and movement practices.

Blending media — The use of both traditional and digital media in art.

Career integration — Exploring the idea of combining a love for art and movement into a sustainable career, navigating societal expectations and personal limitations.

Influence of music — How different music genres can inspire movement, showing a connection between auditory stimuli and physical expression.


@chunbaker on Instagram.

(Written with help from Chat-GPT.)

Resilient – with René Scavington

René Scavington joins Craig to discuss the evolution of parkour, his new film and his ongoing quest for innovation and wonder.

I feel like if I’m trying to do bigger jumps, there’s a smaller window of time because I’m eventually going to tip off in power output. But flips and other freestyle type moves, I feel like I can age with those a little better. […] I think if we’re going to expect anything out of me, I would say it might be more of that. In the future, just trying to be a bit more playful— A bit more loose. And I think that was harder to do in the early days of parkour. I think scenes and communities were a little meaner.

~ René Scavington 24:27

René gravitates around the evolution and nuances of parkour, revealing his perspectives and experiences within the discipline. He touches on experimentation, highlighting its growing acceptance over time. He notes the shift from a past where trying odd moves or playful variations was met with disdain, contrasting it with the current atmosphere where experimentation is often embraced and sometimes even celebrated.

René goes into his personal journey and the meticulous, relentless dedication he embodies in his practice. The conversation reveals the essence of René’s movement captured in his forthcoming film, Resilient. René speaks candidly about his 20-year commitment to parkour, and about his attitude despite the challenges. His discusses his relentless pursuit of certain flips, acknowledging the struggle to balance his progression in flips alongside the continuous advancements in parkour techniques.


Evolution of experimentation — The shift in the parkour community’s attitude toward experimentation.

Relentless dedication — René’s 20-year commitment to parkour reflects his focused and persistent nature.

Resilient — René’s explains the motivations and vision that went into his forthcoming film.

Enduring wonder and curiosity — René shares his perpetual sense of wonder and curiosity, finding inspiration in envisioning new possibilities and an enduring passion for the discipline’s potential.

Resources for everything; Origins Parkour, the STS podcast, René’s new film.

@renescavington René on Instagram Origins Parkour in British Columbia, Canada Sport Parkour League was founded with the mission of creating an engaging competitive platform for parkour athletes that remains true to the culture.

(Written with help from Chat-GPT.)

Communication – with Vincent Thibault

Vincent Thibault joins Craig to discuss the dance between movement and mindfulness, and the balance of effort and ease in training Art du Déplacement.

You don’t have to pretend that you’re in top shape. If you’re not in top shape that very day you just do what you can. You can be yourself and the whole notion of ease is actually very profound, and that’s where my personal training connects with meditation […] One of the first things we learn with Buddhist Meditation is to be friends with yourself. I don’t want to confuse the whole discussion and mix our metaphors here, but there’s this notion of learning to be friends with your own mind, and that can translate into the way you approach movement and any kind of training.

~ Vincent Thibault 35:55

Vincent, a dedicated Buddhist practitioner, engages with Craig in a dynamic conversation encompassing spiritual insights merged with movement philosophy. They discuss the balance between effort and ease within training, stressing the importance of adapting to personal circumstances over time. They touch on Buddhist teachings in the context of physical discipline, emphasizing mindfulness, authentic connection, and embracing change as core tenets of their practice.

[Connection] also means that you could be connected to the people who have been practicing this before you. Whether you’ve learned from the Yamakasi or somebody else, you can acknowledge that. You can appreciate what you’ve received from them. And there’s also connection with the people who will come after you. Because—sorry to deliver the news—but you won’t be there forever and you won’t be coaching forever if you’re a coach. And you won’t be moving in the same way forever, and you don’t know when you’re going to see it.

~ Vincent Thibault 37:30

Throughout their exchange, Vincent and Craig explore the nuances of effort in training, highlighting the significance of finding ease alongside dedication. They go into the broader concept of ‘connection,’ extending beyond physicality to encompass energy levels, environment, and a respectful acknowledgment of both predecessors and successors in the discipline.

They discuss how cultivating internal ease can transcend into disciplined practices, fostering mindfulness and self-acceptance. Vincent underlines the necessity of adaptation, advocating for working with present circumstances rather than fixating on an idealized version of practice.


Effort and Ease — Vincent emphasizes the balance between effort and ease in training, stressing the importance of finding fulfillment in the process rather than solely fixating on results.

Connection Beyond Physicality — The notion of connection expands to encompass various dimensions, including relationships with training partners, acknowledgment of predecessors, and a connection to one’s own energy levels and environment.

Adaptation as Vital — The conversation underscores the significance of adapting to circumstances, encouraging practitioners to work with their current situation rather than against it.

Integration of Buddhist Philosophy — Buddhist principles blend with movement philosophy, highlighting mindfulness, authenticity, and self-acceptance as integral components of disciplined practice.

Authenticity in Practice — Being authentic with oneself and others in training is emphasized, encouraging individuals to be genuine about their abilities, limitations, and present state of being.


Parkour & Art du déplacement: Lessons in practical wisdom – Leçons de sagesse pratique — Vincent Thibault’s 2015 book discussed in the podcast. The book contains both the French and English text. Don’t confuse it with the similarly named, but completely different book, “Parkour and the Art du déplacement: Strength, Dignity, Community”, published in 2014.

L’Art du déplacement : Quatre-vingt-dix propositions philosophiques sur le franchissement d’obstacles — The 2020, French-language-only, edition of the book discussed in this podcast.

Vincent Thibault on LinkedIn.

Carrefours Azure (French-language site) — Vincent’s book publishing company founded in 2016. Fiction and nonfiction. A small publishing house with an innovative and ecological model: books are printed on demand, in Quebec or in France depending on the customer’s shipping address (no pulping, minimal transportation). For every book sold directly on Carrefours azur’s website, a percentage is given back to a green initiative or a humanitarian cause.

Vincent Thibault (French-language site) — Vincent’s personal web site.

Study inspired by… — A series of blog posts, circa 2015, written by Craig, mentioned in this podcast.

(Written with help from Chat-GPT.)

Intentional – with Chris Garay

Intentional – with Chris Garay

Chris Garay joins Craig to discuss balancing varied practices, and how much discipline is actually required for intentional growth.

The conversation revolves around their shared interest in fitness, as they discuss aspects of physical training, the significance of community in fitness spaces, and the challenges of prioritizing various physical practices effectively.

When we show up, we know that [we’re trying] to get better at something via practicing intentionally. But yeah, if it’s not fun, you’re probably not going to stick around and keep going. And that even— honestly, goes back to the discipline [and] willpower. If you constantly have to overcome something just to to start, then you probably won’t start. So if it’s enjoyable and there’s momentum there, that can be very helpful over time.

~ Chris Garay 30:47

Chris and Craig emphasize the need for a balance between discipline and enjoyment in fitness routines. They explore the concept of a gym as a community space, highlighting the value of shared language and camaraderie in training environments. Additionally, they value trying diverse physical practices, but acknowledge the challenge of balancing multiple interests without compromising progress in any one discipline.


Importance of Intentional Practice: the significance of intentional, deep practice in fitness, aiming for progress through focused training rather than scattered efforts across multiple disciplines.

Balancing Discipline and Enjoyment: the necessity of finding a balance between discipline and fun in fitness routines, acknowledging that enjoyable practices lead to more consistent adherence.

Community in Fitness Spaces: the value of a fitness community, where shared language and camaraderie create an environment fostering encouragement, motivation, and a sense of belonging.

Challenges of Multidisciplinary Training: Exploring diverse physical practices poses the challenge of balancing interests while maintaining progress in each discipline, acknowledging the limitations of time and resources for comprehensive development.

Practical Decision-Making: the importance of decisive choices in allocating time and resources, acknowledging that saying no to certain pursuits is crucial for effective focus and progress in chosen areas.

Resources — Chris Garay’s gym in Washington, DC.

@chrisgaray87 — Chris on Instagram.

(Written with help from Chat-GPT.)

Mindset – with Rodrigo Pimentel

Mindset – with Rodrigo Pimentel

Rodrigo Pimentel discusses his catastrophic stroke, and his journey back from the near-death experience.

This is what’s happening— there’s no point in being angry or being bitter. […] and the only thing I can do about it— or rather, in many ways, I can’t do anything about it right now. What I can do is not panic. And not get bitter. All of that will only make me stop… it will only make it worse. This came sort of naturally. I think this is the mindset that I had, this sense— this is what’s happening. This kept coming back to me over and over and over.

~ Rodrigo Pimentel 19:59

Rodrigo Pimentel recounts his stroke experience, reflecting on the unexpectedness and uncertainty that characterized his recovery. He emphasizes the importance of acceptance, revealing how his introspective nature, cultivated through parkour, long-distance running, and meditation, aided his coping mechanism. His ability to embrace introspection, facilitated his acceptance of help and changed his perspective on independence. Throughout the conversation, Rodrigo shares insights on handling adversity, and appreciating the current moment.

All of man’s problems arise from not being able to sit quietly, alone in a room

~ Blaise Pascal

The discussion touches on the introspective nature of parkour and long-distance running, highlighting how these activities provide opportunities for profound self-reflection. Additionally, Rodrigo emphasizes the significance of facing pain with curiosity rather than avoidance, shedding light on his approach to overcoming challenges and embracing acceptance in the face of uncertainty.

So in the end, if you look at the big picture, it’s a big basket of the things I want to do, and it’s all in there together, and I’ll shake it somehow, and my week will come out. All this to say […] in the end, I’d describe my practice as ‘bit of everything’.”

~ Rodrigo Pimentel 34:16


Embracing Acceptance Amid Uncertainty: Rodrigo emphasizes the necessity of accepting circumstances, particularly during his stroke recovery, where uncertainty loomed large. He found solace in acknowledging and adapting to the unknown, recognizing the importance of this mindset in handling unforeseen challenges.

Introspection Through Athletic Pursuits: His engagement in activities like parkour, long-distance running, and meditation facilitated an introspective mindset. These pursuits prompted deep self-reflection, fostering a capacity to delve into his thoughts and emotions, proving invaluable during his recovery.

Navigating Pain and Challenges: Rodrigo’s approach to pain—advocating facing it with curiosity rather than attempting to distract from it. This perspective, learned through running and parkour, allowed him to explore pain and challenges with an inquisitive mindset, a strategy that proved beneficial in overcoming adversities.

Appreciating Independence and Accepting Help: His stroke altered his perspective on independence, leading to a newfound acceptance of help. Despite his inclination to assist others more than seeking aid himself, Rodrigo adapted to accepting assistance graciously during his recovery.


Rodrigo Pimentel’s @hashtagfeet on Instagram.

Haruki Murakami’s, What I Talk About When I Talk About Running

(Written with help from Chat-GPT.)

Growth – with Hayley Chilvers

Hayley Chilvers joins Craig Constantine to dissect the essence of movement, and to unravel the intricate balance between self-expression and engaging with others.

Hayley and Craig talk about movement and podcasting, and the fine balance between personal authenticity and audience engagement. They explore challenges of remaining true to oneself while considering the audience’s experience. Hayley draws from her recent business development experience, emphasizing the importance of authenticity in establishing sustainable ventures.

[…] you can’t build something, I think, sustainably off something that isn’t authentic. I think it needs to be an extension of yourself, especially if it’s you that you’re essentially selling… [if it’s] your, sort of, craft or your skill. That’s something that I find really interesting: The balance between what actually is good practice and what actually is just uniquely you.

~ Hayley Chilvers from 21:30

The conversation navigates the complexities of podcasting for hosts and guests, contemplating how the recording environment shapes the natural flow of conversation. Throughout, they ponder the dichotomy between creating solely for oneself and tailoring content for an audience, with Hayley emphasizing the responsibility one holds when connecting with listeners or viewers.


Movement and Personal Growth: The essence of movement as a means of personal growth, highlighting concepts of freedom, growth, and connection within movement practices.

Entrepreneurial Authenticity: The importance of authenticity in entrepreneurial ventures, pointing out that sustainable business development hinges on aligning personal authenticity with the brand’s essence.

Authenticity in Podcasting: Balancing personal authenticity with engaging the audience was discussed, emphasizing the importance of being genuine while considering the listener’s experience.


@hayley_chilvers on Instagram.

(Written with help from Chat-GPT.)

Faith – with Soisci Porchetta

Soisci Porchetta joins Craig Constantine to discuss the significance of the unexpected, creative expression, and faith in transformative practices.

[…] as a student, [you] cannot be spending 90% of your time with me […] for the majority of people, I really am this— like a supplement. Take these organic fresh herbs and go and thrive. But you have to go and hunt your own meat and vegetables and forage and, you know, have your own thing.

~ Soisci around 23:52

Soisci Porchetta and Craig Constantine range from movement practices to the philosophy of learning and the importance of embracing a generalist approach. Soisci shares insights into her experiences with various physical practices, such as Brazilian jiu-jitsu and handstands, highlighting the significance of embodied knowledge and the value of a beginner’s mindset.

It’s really going full circle from: We ditched chairs and, [we] open up the hips and the spine and the ankles and the knees and squat and elongate positions… And I do a lot of stuff on the floor. I’m most comfortable on the floor. But I think, like, if I can’t sit comfortably in a chair, something is not right as well!

~ Soisci Porchetta around 34:14

The conversation gets to the idea of cycles in one’s journey, drawing parallels between the first love for a particular practice and subsequent explorations. Soisci emphasizes the importance of observation, creativity, and faith in navigating diverse practices, providing anecdotes that underscore the transformative power of such perspectives. Their conversation wanders through the intricacies of movement, meditation, and the paradoxes of learning.


Importance of Embodied Knowledge: Soisci underscores the significance of embodied knowledge, drawing parallels between movement practices like Brazilian jiu-jitsu and handstands to highlight the depth that comes from physical engagement rather than mere intellectual understanding.

The Beginner’s Mindset: The conversation emphasizes the value of maintaining a beginner’s mindset, exploring how approaching new practices with openness and curiosity allows for continual growth and prevents the pitfalls of dogmatism.

Observation as a Practice: Soisci advocates for the practice of keen observation, extending beyond the physical to encompass thoughts, feelings, and the environment. The ability to observe is presented as a foundational element in understanding oneself and the world.

The Role of Faith: Faith is discussed not in a religious context but as a trust in the process of learning. Soisci expresses faith in the capacity to learn and adapt, guided by a belief that a path will unfold with observant exploration.

Expression in Movement: Soisci introduces the idea of creative expression within movement practices, emphasizing that creativity is increasingly becoming a vital aspect of their approach to various disciplines.

Resources — Soisci Porchetta’s “Human Patterns” web site.

@soisci on Instagram.

Why we should all have a form of Movement Practice — Soisci’s blog post referred to in this episode.

Questions Are Not Just For Asking — Blog post by Malcolm Ocean mentioned in this episode.

(Written with help from Chat-GPT.)

Punk – with Amina Shareef Ali

Amina Shareef Ali joins Craig Constantine in a conversation ranging from punk rock to social movements, intertwined values, and the role of parkour in personal transformation.

…so these are transformative conceptual frameworks that have influenced me. But something, I think [critical …], is that they haven’t displaced each other. They’ve necessarily— …in order for it to be, really, a meaningful transformation and not just some kind of flailing, [not what] I might call [a] spiritual bypassing— It has to be integrated with what was already there.

~ Amina Shareef Ali from 26:58

This conversation between Amina Shareef Ali and Craig Constantine gets into the transformative aspects of various experiences in their lives, exploring Parkour, societal perspectives, and personal ideologies. Amina articulates her reflections on integrating multiple transformative frameworks in her life, encompassing academic, political, and personal growth. She emphasizes the importance of integrating new experiences with one’s existing worldviews, highlighting that each transformation enriches rather than displaces previous perspectives.

Throughout this dialogue, they discuss the nuanced ways people interact with spaces, drawing connections between Parkour and societal shifts, aiming to challenge normative articulations of spaces.

And many of the characters who were around were not who I would think of as my people.  There were those a bit too enthralled with shock and sensationalism at whatever cost, or those a bit too comfortable “ironically” espousing fascism.  It took me a long time to understand that in order to find my place within punk, I had to be an active participant in the conversation about what punk is, and could and should be.  Which, paradoxically, meant that I had to believe in my rightful claim to being punk in the first place.

~ Ali from,


Integration of Transformative Frameworks — the significance of integrating various transformative experiences into one’s worldview without displacing each other.

Diverse Perspectives on Space and Society — the impact of societal norms and personal ideologies on the utilization and interpretation of public spaces.

Embracing New Experiences for Personal Growth — that individuals discover new transformative experiences at different stages in their lives, and the importance of being open to and integrating these experiences with one’s existing worldviews.


On Parkour and Punk — Ali’s

Ali’s website and Instagram account and @meaniemoves

Once Is Never — “Once is never. Twice is luck. Three times is parkour.”

(Written with help from Chat-GPT.)

Solo – with Bane

Craig Constantine and Bane free-dive into the world of training alone, where challenges are intrinsic and progress is incremental.

Bane discusses the personal nature of parkour practice. He emphasizes the idea that “your movement is your own,” highlighting the deeply individualized and intrinsic aspect of the discipline. He also discusses the balance between solo training and group training, noting that both have their advantages. He recognizes the value of training with others for inspiration and learning different movement styles, while also emphasizing the benefits of solitary practice for self-discovery and personal goals.

I’m not worried about forcing it and making it happen… I’m going to do it when I’m ready to do it and it’s about coaxing that readiness out of me.
~ Bane, 29:20

Balancing Solo and Group Training: While solo training provides personal introspection and development, group training offers opportunities to learn from others, gain inspiration, and push boundaries. Bane suggests that striking a balance between the two can lead to a more well-rounded parkour journey.

Sustainability and Flexibility in Training: Bane emphasizes the importance of sustainable training practices. Instead of rigidly adhering to a strict training regimen, he advocates for flexibility in incorporating various physical activities and training methods, which not only enhances physical capabilities but also prevents burnout.

Patience and Mindful Progression: Bane’s approach underscores the importance of patience and mindful progression. This mindset not only ensures safety but also fosters a deeper understanding and mastery of the discipline.

Learning from Different Environments: The discussion touches upon the significance of training in diverse environments.

Your movement is your own. It’s so personal in parkour… your challenges are intrinsic to yourself, to what you want to achieve, to what you’re capable of.
~ Bane, 25:00

Personalization of Parkour: Parkour is a deeply personal practice. Participants have the freedom to define their own goals, challenges, and techniques.

Books mentioned: Breaking the Jump by Julie Angel, Born to Run by Christopher McDougall

(Written with help from Chat-GPT.)

Matrix – with Ryland Lanagan

Matrix – with Ryland Lanagan

Join Craig Constantine and Ryland Lanagan as they discuss Ryland’s journey towards longevity, where functional fitness and the sheer joy of movement lead to a healthier and happier life.

[When asked what gets adults engaged?] 100%, it is fun. Fun is that common ingredient… Everybody that gives themselves permission to come in and maybe falter in front of strangers or put themselves out there— Once you’re willing to do that and you start to learn techniques, or you’re starting to exercise, a whole cascade of things happen.

~ Ryland Lanagan ~24’30”

Ryland introduces his Movement Matrix Method, a structured approach to learning parkour that is specifically designed for adults. He shares his remarkable journey from an overweight and disheartened Army veteran to a passionate advocate for parkour. He describes how parkour became a lifelong passion that has not only transformed him physically, but also transformed his outlook on life.

Passion and Fun: The driving force behind Ryland’s commitment to parkour is the sheer joy and fun it brings. Parkour allows people to challenge themselves, experience constant improvement, and get a sense of accomplishment, all while having a great time.

Movement Matrix Method: Ryland describes his movement program incorporating a structured approach to teaching parkour skills, ensuring students progress safely and effectively.

Physical and Mental Benefits: Parkour offers numerous physical and mental benefits. It helps individuals feel proud of their accomplishments. Moreover, it’s a form of exercise that can enhance bone density, improve cardiovascular health, and increase overall strength, contributing to a better quality of life as people age.

Longevity and Functional Fitness: Ryland emphasizes that parkour isn’t just about flashy moves but also about developing functional fitness. It helps individuals maintain their independence and confidence as they age. Whether it’s carrying groceries, climbing stairs, or playing with grandkids, it enhances everyday experiences.

Starting Early: While it’s never too late to start parkour, Ryland recommends that people begin as soon as possible to avoid letting decades pass without engaging in physical activity. It’s important to respect one’s physical limits, start slowly if necessary, and commit to continuous improvement.

Passion is Contagious: Ryland’s enthusiasm for parkour is contagious, and he believes that sharing this passion with others can inspire them to try parkour and experience its benefits.

(Written with help from Chat-GPT)


I’ve been stumbling more over graphic depictions and graphic novels. There’s this fun book Out on the Wire by Jessica Abel which describes the storytelling secrets of the new masters of radio. I’ve read another graphic novel about finance and the visual element really brings the stories to life. (See Craig learn, sorry.) In hindsight, I don’t understand at all why this would have surprised me. I spent gobs of time reading comics like Calvin and Hobbes and Bloom County in book form and they’re graphic novels if you read the entire arc in one go.

Our thoughts are a composite process. We really do think with our entire bodies.

~ Alex Pavlotski from,

Pavlotski is another example. I had a wonderful conversation, Ethnography, leadership, and trajectory, with him for the Movers Mindset podcast. He is probably best-known for his work visualizing Parkour, but there’s much more to his work than just the drawing portion. This is not just a guy who does parkour, who also happens to draw kewl cartoons.