Remodeling with Sean Hannah

What does it take to stop avoiding pain and instead use it as a guide for rebuilding the body?

The same movements that caused injury can heal it when performed slowly, partially, and with intention.

What we try to do is get people to understand that if you have pain, if you have a limitation, you don’t stop doing the thing that hurt it. You do the thing that hurt it, slow, partial, light, take it down to the baby amount, the tolerable amount, and then start pushing it back up the scale. And by the time you can do it fast and heavy again, you’re healed. Congratulations.

~ Sean Hannah (9:19)

The conversation explores why most people avoid the slow, deliberate work required to truly rehabilitate injuries rather than just return to basic function. The distinction between physical therapy (designed for baseline recovery) and full joint remodeling (a months-to-years process typically reserved for elite athletes) forms the foundation of the discussion. The key insight is that healing requires doing the same movements that caused injury—but slower, lighter, and more partial—rather than avoiding them entirely.

Pain emerges as a multifaceted phenomenon with three distinct layers: actual tissue damage, neuropathic pain (trauma responses encoded in nerves and fascia), and centralized pain (psychological amplification based on beliefs and language). The conversation addresses how someone might present with a knee problem but actually need a full head-to-toe biomechanical remodel, with the knee simply being where the dysfunction surfaces most visibly. The discussion also touches on the origins of the nickname “Seanobi” (an Irish ninja wordplay), the value of intuitive three-dimensional movement versus linear athletic training, and the importance of having something worth playing for as the motivational spark that makes the difficult rehabilitation process possible.

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Subtraction with Nima King

What happens when you stop trying so hard and learn to find power through subtraction rather than addition?

Wing Chun training in a Hong Kong living room involves hours of standing still with no sparring, forcing practitioners to confront inner demons and abandon Western goal-seeking mentality.

I’ll tell you, Craig, this was the hardest thing at that time that I had to go through, both physically and mentally, because […] it’s just so difficult, you know, standing still there, not moving. It’s just so difficult! All these inner demons start to come up. You start thinking, and you know, there’s nowhere to hide.

~ Nima King (5:17)

Nima King describes his journey from training as a teenaged bouncer in Sydney, to becoming a student of Grandmaster Chu in Hong Kong, where his expectations of intense sparring and rooftop battles were replaced by hours of standing practice in a small living room. The training focused on empty hand forms rather than fighting techniques, creating a physically and mentally challenging experience where inner demons surfaced and there was nowhere to hide. Grandmaster Chu provided hands-on guidance through tactile cues, manipulating posture and stance to help students release tension points gradually rather than through sudden breakthrough moments. The practice required abandoning the Western mindset of conceptualization and goal-seeking in favor of embodied experience, with Nima’s teacher eventually banning him from asking questions to force this transition.

The conversation explores how martial arts principles apply to modern life, including parenting and professional goals. Nima discusses the challenge of not trying too hard despite his natural inclination toward the mentality of pushing through pain and injury. The practice teaches that letting go of control represents a powerful act rather than laziness or apathy, and that vulnerability challenges conventional masculine ideals of strength through aggression. Grandmaster Chu exemplified this power through humility, always bowing lower and greeting students with warmth rather than displays of dominance. The art becomes about subtraction rather than accumulation, finding ways to achieve goals with less effort by allowing things to happen rather than forcing them.

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«Partage» with Stany Foucher

What new formats and practices best transmit Art du Déplacement’s culture—beyond technique—so practitioners can reflect, connect, and grow together?

Art du Déplacement’s culture is deepened through «partage», reflective practice formats, and distinctive training like vision work and night missions.

Still, I had the fear, but I knew where I was, where I was going, [and] how— I knew myself better, basically. So this very strong experience with my friends, and this strong experience of failure— That was really an in between moment for me. […]There is before that training session at the «Dame du Lac» experiencing all this. And then there is me discovering more about my inner self and being very different in the way I approach fear.

~ Stany Foucher (1:33:00)

The discussion frames Art du Déplacement as a living culture rather than simply a set of techniques. Stany’s recently published, French-language book is highlighted as a deliberate choice, made with the awareness that language shapes who can engage with the ideas. (Craig and Stany hope that an English translation can eventually be created which captures the subtlety and depth of the material.) The strengths of books—slower pacing and deeper digestion—are compared to the reach and immediacy of video. This leads to exploring audio as a practice medium, with the idea of podcast-led movement sessions modeled on audio yoga classes. The conversation also touches on the value of building shared reference points across the community, so practitioners in different places can connect through common experiences.

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2,800 weeks of progress

All original parts, some wear. As I’m starting to look for opportunities to coach in movement spaces, a headshot is a requisite.

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Translating

Stany Foucher recently wrote a book, Art du Déplacement: Au delà du saut. I’ve been working on translating it for my own reading. I can read the French language at an “advanced beginner” level. From the epub version of the book (which I printed so I can write on it), I’m working in a notebook… writing things out longhand is part of the learning process. I don’t simply want to read this book, but rather I want to apprehend this book.

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Curiosity with David Wilson

How can older adults reclaim movement as a joyful, empowering part of life despite pervasive cultural narratives about aging?

Letting go of perfectionism opens the door to playfulness and self-compassion.

If I can be more compassionate toward myself, I can let go of this addiction to competence and just let myself try, and suck. So yeah, I have come to embrace the idea that if a thing is worth doing, it is worth doing badly and playfully.

~ David Wilson (48:45)

This conversation with David Wilson explores how movement intersects with aging, self-perception, and cultural narratives. David begins by addressing how deeply internalized ageist beliefs affect people’s willingness to move, take up space, and try new things. The discussion challenges the idea that aging necessitates physical decline, emphasizing instead that variety in movement and awareness of personal stories can lead to growth and transformation at any age. David also critiques societal pressures that promote fear-based motivation, and he encourages a shift toward framing movement as a present-moment gift.

The conversation moves through practical barriers and misconceptions that keep people inactive, such as rigid goals, perfectionism, and the belief that certain types of exercise are required. It emphasizes meeting oneself where one is, using personal values rather than fixed goals as guides. The importance of self-compassion, playfulness, and the willingness to “do things badly” is highlighted as a more sustainable path toward movement. There’s also a critique of mainstream fitness messaging, which often excludes older populations by failing to address their actual lived experiences.

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Empowering with Nina Ballantyne

What makes parkour jam spaces unique, and how do they shape the experience of movement, community, and accessibility?

A church, a jam space, and a parkour gym—what do they have in common, and why does it matter?

The empowerment, and the kind of liberation to not care what other people think, does have a limit for some folk, I guess. I love it. I think for me, it’s been great and really powerful. I really like not caring anymore about being bad at stuff in particular— that’s so freeing.

~ Nina Ballantyne (14:00)

The conversation explores the concept of parkour jam spaces, emphasizing how they lack defined boundaries, making them more accessible in theory but sometimes intimidating in practice. The discussion touches on the contrast between structured athletic environments and the open, fluid nature of parkour, where new participants must navigate unspoken social norms rather than physical barriers. The conversation also highlights the paradox of accessibility—while jam spaces remove formal entry requirements, social and cultural factors can still create obstacles, especially for marginalized individuals.

The discussion transitions into broader themes of public space, inclusivity, and the intersection of parkour with community projects. A significant portion focuses on an initiative to purchase a historic church in Edinburgh and transform it into a community space. The conversation reflects on how physical spaces carry different meanings based on personal and cultural perspectives. The comparison between parkour jam spaces and community-driven spaces like the church highlights the broader theme of reclaiming and redefining public areas for collective benefit.

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Insight with Cristina Latici

What makes a great movement coach, and how do they balance structure, intuition, and individual learning styles to help students progress?

Teaching movement is as much about reading people as it is about teaching physical skills.

You have to wait— you just have to wait and see. It’s not always the right time to give feedback.

~ Cristina Latici (15:22)

The conversation explores the nuances of movement coaching, particularly in the context of parkour and dance. The discussion highlights the importance of understanding each student’s background and learning style, emphasizing observation over immediate correction. Cristina describes her approach, which involves assessing a student’s experience, allowing them space to explore, and offering small, precise adjustments when necessary. She reflects on the parallels between her parkour coaching and her past as a dancer, noting how both disciplines require a deep awareness of movement and the ability to convey complex physical concepts to others.

[Yoda and Luke] are having a conversation and Luke’s bitching, as usual. And Yoda says something to the effect of, “we are what they grow beyond.” And the point that’s being made is, if you’re a coach and you don’t make students who are better than you, you’re not a good coach.

~ Craig Constantine (22:04)

Another key theme is the role of community in movement practice. Cristina discusses how the group dynamic influences training, particularly when working with long-term students versus new participants. She also highlights the challenges of coaching adults versus children, explaining how her background in special education informs her patience and adaptability in coaching. The conversation touches on the idea of “touch” as an intuitive sense developed through movement practice, illustrating how familiarity with movement can enhance both safety and creativity.

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What lies ahead?

For a while, the Movers Mindset podcast’s episodes had opening segments recorded in post-production. They were as you’d expect: Here’s who’s on the show, this is who they are, here are a few things we talk about. This (as you surely know) is a bit of work. In later years—particularly once I was working entirely alone—I simply stopped doing this because, taking the time to do it, stopped me from actually getting the episodes out the door.

LISTENERS CAN’T “SEE” (OR HEAR) WHAT’S AHEAD. When you read a story in a newspaper, your peripheral vision gives you an idea of the stories that surround it. […] On the radio, someone needs to tell you explicitly what’s coming up.

~ Jonathan Kern, from Sound Reporting, p6

NPR has a concept called “billboards” which are short segments, up-front (“58 seconds long, at the top of the hour”) telling you what’s coming.

How do you (if you do) decide what you put on your “billboard” at the front of the show? Do you have goals; list three things, list something for every major turn in the conversation, etc.? Do you use any tools to help you?

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Craig Constantine: Parkour evangelist

My good friend Mark Hochgesang recently invited me to be on his Heavy Hitter Sports. I have heavy imposter syndrome when it comes to talking about movement. None the less, here’s the episode…

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https://www.heavyhittersports.com/craig-constantine-parkour-evangelist

Craig Constantine, the host of the Movers Mindset podcast, shares the wonders of parkour with host Mark Hochgesang. Craig highlights the physical & mental challenges & rewards of this one-of-a-kind sport birthed from the Paris suburbs. Parkour newcomers & veterans alike will be entertained & enlightened by Craig’s engaging storytelling.

Craig’s Website: https://constantine.name/
Craig’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/craigconstantine/
Craig’s Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/craig.constantine.page/
Movers Mindset Podcast: https://moversmindset.com/podcast/
Open+Curious Podcast: https://openandcurious.org/
Podtalk Podcast: https://podtalk.show/about/

Julie Angel’s Movement of Three Film: https://julieangel.com/filmmaker/

Listeners, please subscribe to Heavy Hitter Sports wherever you listen to podcasts so that you don’t miss any future episodes. Ideally, please also rate and review the show. And share this episode with a coworker, friend or family member who it might benefit.

Feel free to reach out if you have suggestions re future episode guests or topics. Mark’s contact info is noted below. Many thanks.

mphochgesang@gmail.com
971-985-6909